Talking to Irrational People

I have a reputation in barroom circles (and others) of being rather argumentative and opinionated. I can't deny it. I used to argue with my father and we both enjoyed it, though my poor mother found it quite distressing. We both enjoyed the intellectual exercise. Even then, however, I felt that there were times when I had made a perfectly reasonable point that ol' Dad wouldn't concede. And to be honest, there were times I knew that my own case wasn't solid, and I would be defending my position just because it was mine. Still, I was young and learning, and I hope I am less inclined now to simply defend my position rather than admit I may be mistaken.

Regarding the aforementioned barroom discussions, they tend to be unsatisfying. What do I expect in a bar? Okay, not much. But though ignorant jackasses abound, not EVERYONE in every bar is an ignorant jackass. There are times when I am having a discussion with, say, a successful attorney. A person might reasonably expect him to be logical and able to listen. That person would be mistaken.

My 'lawyer acquaintance' is not so much unable as unwilling. Just to give a small example, we were superficially discussing health care in the USA. Rather than talking about what system might be best for all citizens, he returned over and over to his contention that Doctors were underpaid, and that his own brother, apparently a genius in his eyes, had chosen some other profession because doctors just weren't paid enough. (average salary for a family doctor in his home town is about $122k a year. His father was a doctor, and the family wealthy by most standards) The lawyer repeated over and over how when HE was sick, he wanted the best and brightest to treat him. My suggestion that perhaps a the best qualifications to be a doctor might not be a combination of greed and a high SAT score fell on deaf ears. He repeated his point over and over until I finally threw in the towel. And therein lies the heart of the matter I want to discuss. (With no interruptions... that's why I love this blogging stuff). Why is it so difficult (or impossible) to discuss certain subjects rationally with otherwise rational and intelligent people?

I will get right to the point. It comes down to something present in all humans, and something very pronounced in those who are hardest to discuss anything with. I don't have just one word to describe it, unfortunately. To call it simply 'ego' doesn't totally cover it. It's not just egotism and pride that make humans cling to what they already believe and reject what they don't. Ego and pride are a big part of it, but not quite the whole story. In his wonderful book, "How Real is Real?" www.amazon.com/How-Real-Paul-Watzlawick/dp/0394722566 Paul Watzlawick explains how the point of thinking is to avoid further thinking. I can't possibly do it justice here, but he makes a good case that people aren't really looking for 'truth' with a capital T, rather that they are looking for something (an idea, for example) that allows them to stop thinking. Some people can't stop thinking even when they try, but I don't want to get too sidetracked here.

Human beings all have a 'world view' of some sort, a belief system, call it what you will (Weltanschauung, perhaps). The fact that it is a 'system' means that to tamper with a part of it can be dangerous to the whole system. Galileo was jailed for saying that the Earth orbited the Sun and not vice-versa.

I have come to the conclusion that the idea of 'man, the rational animal' is pretty ludicrous. Sure, we are more rational than a sea slug or a Cocker Spaniel. Big deal. To get back to where this all began, my barroom attempts to make a point about almost anything that conflicts with any part of my 'lawyer acquaintance's' 'Weltanschauung' run into all kinds of opposition, little if any of which was based on fact or logical argumentation.

(Check the link below for a nice post about 'faulty argument patterns.' It's better written than THIS MESS)
vagabondscholar.blogspot.com/2006/10/faulty-argument-patterns-and-informal.html

My 'lawyer acquaintance' and countless others do the same sorts of things that are the current standard of 'discussion' in media and government all over the world. Sadly, although there are still people who seek truth with a capital T to the best of their abilities, they don't constitute a majority or even a sizable minority in the media, government or general population. Certainly they are rare in my local bar.

I have come to the conclusion, sadly, that rational and fact based discussion is just not going to happen on the scale needed to fix the big problems or even smaller ones that face our respective countries and the planet earth as a whole. I may get into this subject in a little more detail in the future, but my brain is tired: Too much thinking.